- cross-posted to:
- politics@beehaw.org
- cross-posted to:
- politics@beehaw.org
He may not be in office, but Donald Trump has been speaking with the powers that be about Israel’s war on Gaza—but it’s not in an effort to end the genocide.
Instead, Trump has allegedly been talking with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to avert a cease-fire deal, fearing that doing so could help Vice President Kamala Harris win in November, according to PBS.
“The reporting is that former President Trump is on the phone with the Prime Minister of Israel, urging him not to cut a deal right now, because it’s believed that would help the Harris campaign,” said PBS’s Judy Woodruff Monday night. “So, I don’t know where—who knows whether that will come about or not, but I have to think that the Harris campaign would like for President Biden to do what presidents do, and that’s to work on that one.”
The “genocide Joe” crowd are, for the most part, well aware that Trump is just as bad for Gaza as Joe is. They’re not arguing for supporting Trump, they’re arguing that both choices are bad.
This is not a rational position, obviously, because if you care about protecting Palestine you’re still better off supporting the Dems to avoid the worse option of Trump, but for a lot of people it’s hard to stomach the idea of voting for a murderer, no matter what the justification is. The not entirely unreasonable argument is that voting for the Dems to avoid the worse option basically encourages the Dems to be more shitty because they know they can always throw the threat of the GOP in everyone’s faces when they’re called out. I don’t agree with this argument, but I see how it’s compelling to people.
They’re not Trump supporters - at least, not intentionally - they’re just sick of the whole dicochtomy of being asked to choose between bad and worse. I can understand their frustration, even if I don’t agree with the choice they’re making.
Trump is not “as bad” as Biden. Trump is significantly worse. Trump has said he wants to ramp things up, and for Israel to “finish the job.” There is no “as bad” here. There won’t be any Gazans left under Trump most likely. There certainly won’t be a Gaza separate from Israel at least.
Why are we still defending Biden vs Trump? Harris “won’t stay silent” about Palestine.
Yeah, I don’t know. I was baited into it I guess. Biden sint running anymore. I don’t know if it’s best to just ignore these people or still refute them though. Maybe it’s best to just tell them Biden isn’t running?
Didn’t we just send them more ‘aid’ while they continue to massacre children? Did she speak up and oppose that? Israel is going to commit their atrocities and eradicate Palestine and neither party will oppose it. Arguing about dumb shit Trump says is just a distraction from the actual actions of Democrats. I’m so sick of Democrats telling me that I have to vote for them because otherwise Republicans will do what they are doing but worse.
Here’s what she said: https://www.cnn.com/2024/07/25/politics/harris-netanyahu-israel-hamas-ceasefire/index.html
I agree, for the most part. However, i do believe a lot of them are Trump supporters, willingly.
Except the ones which are saying it simply to encourage people to stop voting. They do that to dem voters only though suspiciously
There is no comparison between the two. Trump is unimaginably worse. The only thing anyone has against Biden is his son (which isn’t anything to do with him) and Israel, which Biden is likely trying to get a ceasefire in the background
I’m sitting here in Australia as he’s telling you guys exactly how he is going to fuck you over… He’s dropping hints constantly that he won’t leave power and introduce laws to extend his term if he wins
He’s definitely going to pardon more criminals. It’s scary to think of how much damage he’ll do on a second term internationally, as he’s done plenty the first time.
If Trump ends his term knowing he’s going to jail, don’t be surprised if he leaks all the classified information to everyone to make it seem like he’s fighting for freedom and try to get more power
Are there any Republicans on Lemmy that you’d like us to address? Where?
This is completely baseless speculation at best, and essentially a conspiracy theory at worst. Biden has given consistent, unconditional support to Israel throughout the current genocide and through his entire decades long career.
Reasonable speculation, based on recent and past behavior, would suggest that what’s actually happening in the background is that Biden and Netanyahu are operating in lockstep, and any contrary statements they make are keyfabe, with private assurances that there will be no disruption of material aid. On the other hand, we could not rely on speculation at all and just look at the facts, that Biden has been completely behind Netanyahu on anything that actually matters, materially.
Did you want a list of dogshit that Trump has done? Nobody has time to write that list (the “good” things he’s done are mostly limited though, so that is quick). The list is totally opposite for Biden… Before Trump a bj in the oval office was considered bad. Now we discover new worse stuff on a weekly basis
Trump literally told the proud boys to “stand Back and stand by”… Publicly… In front of everyone… In case you need a reminder of what a bunch of fuckwits they are, refer to: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proud_Boys . **That’s indesputable proof that trump supports bigotry. **
You have to be blind at this point to call a convicted rapist who cheats on taxes and abuses everyone (whose own staff WARNS the general public about), to Biden, who hasn’t supported the israel war publicly (oh, but for some reason it’s “reasonable speculation” when it’s YOUR opinion). Trump can’t even get an endorsement from his former VP (that’s how little he can be trusted)
I’m sitting here in Australia, and I’m watching similar shit go down similar to the insurrection… YET AGAIN!!! As we get closer, he’ll ramp the rhetoric up and start saying it’s rigged, and dropping “truth bombs” which don’t have any evidence against them (but no evidence supporting them).
He tries to gain power through hate… Biden did not. Kamala and Walz do not.
They are not the same…
Nobody said they are the same, we just said we’re not going to vote for somebody we don’t support. If Trump is so terrifyingly bad then maybe the Democratic platform should try to get more voters. I’m sick of terrorist style voting tactics where Trump being bad is the only reason to vote for Democrats, but the Democrats are barely different on the issue I care about.
It’s why you have to pointlessly ramble on about various crap Trump did instead of defending the Democratic platform or stay on topic
A vote for no one is claiming they’re the same. This is exactly on topic. You want a list though: https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2024/02/02/joe-biden-30-policy-things-you-might-have-missed-00139046
Trump is Hitler 2.0. If your freedom is something you don’t care about, and you don’t have any female friends or family, then I guess it is easy to sit on the fence…
The reason everyone talks about Trump’s shitiness, is because he voting for him is like giving a promotion to your high school bully. It’s irrational for anyone to vote for a guy who hates you. Biden isn’t even the candidate at the moment either, so the difference is even more glaring now what a prick Trump is
Not really. It implies that neither are good enough, not that they are the same.
Is it freedom when I have to vote at the threat of Hitler 2.0 every year? Am I not allowed to pull politicians back to my positions when they get too far out of whack? Why are you blaming your fellow
Americansclassmen for not electing your candidate, instead of asking your candidate to be more electable? Nevermind you; how about the candidate themselves, scolding people for not electing them?How do you know the entire democratic platform isn’t just empty platitudes? Roe V Wade/ Dobbs happened on Democrats’ watch. In fact, everything the supreme court is doing is happening on Biden’s watch, as he didn’t do much more than float adding justices to make it less partisan. Everything with the economy, food prices, housing, healthcare, and the gaslighting instead of action on those fronts, is on their watch. They’ve completely given up on opposing the anti-immigration narratives coming from the right…
We’re tired of democrats running on being controlled opposition to the republicans. They need to do more than just imply or let us assume they’re going to do things because it opposes what the other guy is doing. They need to reach deep and find some policy positions of their own and earn votes because they’re actually popular. Not because they’re not the other guy.
I’d like to vote for Kamala in November but I also think it’s important to hold out until I personally find her platform compelling on its own merits, not on any pressure campaign or the implied lack of anyone else’s. Change and progress don’t happen by being passive and letting people shout you down.
Oh yeah? What if the other guy is worse!?
Imagine, for a moment, that there is no democratic party. Trump is the furthest left you can go, the closest you can get to progress, and the other guy is promising to take you backwards. This is not bizarro world, Trump will take you backwards too, and will still tell the world that anyone to the left of him is a radical, including you. Just not as bad as the other guy.
Just humor me. You’d be irrational not to vote for Trump, no? Even though he hates you? Even to make him squirm a little bit and win some concessions?
You’d vote for the other guy, just because he’s not Trump? Cause that guy hates you too, probably worse. Not vote? Well obviously that’s a vote for the other guy. Sorry, I don’t make the rules. I just vote for the people that do.
No, I’m well aware of it.
It’s very funny to me that you’re defending Biden by talking about Trump when Biden isn’t even running anymore. There is no longer any “lesser evil” argument for you to hide behind. Trump is completely irrelevant to Biden’s record and I won’t acknowledge a word about that in that context.
Before Biden became the Democratic nominee in 2020, it was perfectly acceptable to criticize him and call a spade a spade. He’s one of the architects of mass incarceration, and of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, he’s an irredeemable monster with the blood of hundreds of thousands of innocent people on his hands. But once he was up against Trump, all you people choose to willfully deceive yourselves into this fantasy that he’s some kind of progressive figure. And now, the reason for that self-deception is gone, but you’re still deluding yourself and licking his boots. It’s pathetic.
I’m not willing to lie to myself or anyone else for the sake of helping some war criminal win an election that I don’t even have a voice in, seeing as I don’t live in a swing state. But it’s even worse for you to do it not even having a vote here at all. You’re lieing to yourself for the sake of these horrible people when it doesn’t even help them in any way.
Yes, because my speculation comes from facts and evidence, not wishful thinking. As I said though, no speculation is actually necessary.