Despite all the doom scrolling, Harris has a comfortable lead in the electoral college right now.
The time for vibing is over. It’s too late to change anyone’s opinions (especially because national level events like debates are over). Harris will finish her Media Blitz soon (including a Fox News showing) while Trump retreats into his shell hoping no one notices how damn stupid his mouth is.
This is the time for doing. The focus should be on voter drives and other get out the vote pushes. It’s mid October, and the October surprises are against Trump and in our favor.
It’s not the lead we wanted but it’s a lead nonetheless. Don’t talk yourself out of believing this lead because of a bad poll or two.
I already mailed in my ballot. I can doomscroll all I want until next election.
You managed to Vote Early, but you have completely skipped the bit on Voting Often.
They won’t let me vote multiple times because I’m not a Republican :(
I think they’re talking about local elections like AG and state supreme Court
If you’re lucky, you might be able to doomscroll forever!
I will only be comfortable after she’s inaugurated.
I see someone learned from 2000
Harris doesn’t have a comfortable lead in the EC, what are you talking about? Even your own posted article says she’s within the margin of error nationally, and the race is closer in the swing states than in the national polls. That’s by definition not a “comfortable lead.”
Biden won with 4.5% more of the national vote. Harris currently is polling at about half that. In the EC, Biden won by only 78,000 votes despite his large +4.5% popular vote lead.
Two different polls in the last two days have flipped two swing states over to Trump. Nate Silver’s polling aggregator reflect the many, many polls that have shown Trump gaining in multiple swing states. Silver’s projections reflect this by indicating a six point drop for Harris to win the EC since the end of September.
Optimism is fine, hopium is not. No high quality polling shows Harris with a “comfortable lead” in the electoral college.
These “don’t worry be happy” posts seem like they’re coming straight from the Trump campaign. Harris has a comfortable lead, I guess I don’t have to worry! Even if you say “but you have to vote,” the psychological effect of denying the state of the race with hopium like this is to make people feel less concerned and more complacent about voting.
Biden won by only 78,000 votes despite his large +4.5% popular vote lead.
The magic of the Electoral College. 2024 is expected to get even worse, as states like California and Texas lean harder left than at any point in recent history, but California can’t yield any more EC votes than it already does and Texas Dems will still be a point or two shy of winning the state under the most Dem-leaning models.
Swing states are all that matter. And once they’ve swung far enough (as in the case of Virginia and Colorado and Florida) they stop mattering again.
Optimism is fine, hopium is not.
Be an optimist. Be a pessimist. It doesn’t matter. The folks with the biggest thumbs on the scales are mega-donors, media magnets, and the majorities on various state and federal courts. At some point, you have to realize that your vote matters far less than there’s. It’s a rich man’s country, we just live in it.
I agree with your general view that it’s not actually time to relax.
But I will point out that you can’t just assume the electoral college advantage stays the same from election to election.
Biden won with 4.5% more of the national vote. Harris currently is polling at about half that. In the EC, Biden won by only 78,000 votes despite his large +4.5% popular vote lead.
In 2020, Biden won by 4.5% in the popular vote, but he won the tipping point state of Wisconsin by 0.6%. In other words, the electoral college was worth roughly a R+3.8% advantage in 2020 (yes, 4.5% minus 0.6% is 3.9% but when you use unrounded numbers it’s closer to 3.8%).
Is 2024 going to be the same? Probably not. The New York Times ran an article about this last month, and the tipping point state in the polling was Wisconsin, where Harris was polling at +1.8%, only 0.7% lower than the national average at the time of 2.6%. The article noted that national polling has Trump shrinking Harris’s lead in non-competitive blue states like California and New York, or expanding his lead in places like the deep south, while not gaining in actual swing states compared to 2020.
Note, however, that as of today, Harris’s lead in Wisconsin has shrunk to just under 1%, so we are seeing a shift towards Trump in the actual electoral college.
Right now, Harris is showing a lead in the national polling averages, by aggregator:
- 538: Harris up by 2.4%
- NYT: Harris up by 3%
- 270towin: Harris up 2.5%
- Nate Silver: Harris up 2.9%
It’s a close race, according to the polls. But whether the polls are actually accurate remains a huge unknown. So everyone should vote, and those with the means should volunteer.
I generally agree with you here, and I think we’re expressing a similar point. And the general sentiment that the electoral landscape can shift from one election to another is true, but I think it’s worth underscoring that the changes you’re discussing haven’t yet led to a significant break in the tightness of the 2024 race. The fact that Harris’s lead in Wisconsin has shrunk from 1.8% to just under 1% recently is exactly the point. This shows momentum shifting toward Trump, not to mention the same trend in other swing states.
You’re correct that the Electoral College advantage may change slightly in 2024, but as of now, the fundamentals we’re looking at are pointing toward a very close contest in the key battleground states. It’s not just the national polling averages that matter here—it’s the state-level dynamics that determine the outcome, and recent polls show the swing states tightening, which is why it’s reckless to assume Harris is in a secure position. Even Nate Silver’s model, which tends to account for some unpredictability, has downgraded Harris’s chances since the end of September.
National polling averages like the ones you cited (538, NYT, etc.) paint a picture of a close race, and while they show a lead for Harris, the recent shifts we’re seeing in Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, and Georgia, among others, indicate that Trump is gaining ground. The fact that Harris’s national lead is shrinking in traditionally blue states like New York and California actually emphasizes her vulnerabilities in the swing states, where the race is most critical.
Bottom line: There’s no data right now that suggests a significant shift in the electoral college advantage for 2024. In fact, if anything, Trump’s recent gains are pushing the tipping point states even closer. With polls this tight and the Electoral College looking like a replay of 2020’s knife-edge margins, it’s exactly the wrong time to get complacent. Everyone should be treating this as an all-hands-on-deck situation.
Bottom line: There’s no data right now that suggests a significant shift in the electoral college advantage for 2024.
There’s a ton of uncertainty in the data now.
2016 and 2020 polls missed Trump popularity, and about 2/3 of pollsters have decided to use recall vote weighting (that is, making sure that their sample is representative of the vote ratios in the actual 2020 results). Historically, that method has overstated the previous losing party’s support (people are more likely to remember voting for the winner, so reweighing the results the other way ends up favoring the loser), but 2 presidential elections in a row have caused some pollsters to try to make up for past mistakes. Then again, does Trump himself being on the ballot change things?
Throw in the significant migration patterns of the pandemic era where many voters might not be voting in the same state that they were in 2020, and increasing difficulty at actually getting statistically representative poll respondents through spam filters, and there are real concerns about poll quality this year, perhaps more than previous years. Plus ballot access being uneven also might translate to actual voting biases that aren’t captured in the polling methods, either.
I just wouldn’t trust the polls to be accurate. Volunteer and vote.
Yeah. Looks like we read similar things.
My gut tells me Trump is going to win. I don’t think voter suppression, shenanigans, and armed militia members patrolling polling sites can be factored into polling predictions, and with razor-thin margins, that in aggregate might make the difference. Combined with the mild Trump surge… but that’s all feels not reals. And, of course, I hope I’m wrong.
agreed. Trumpers always underreport their support because they know its shameful and dont want to admit it. So the poll numbers are almost certainly worse for Harris than they appear. Harris (and Biden shares the blame) are on track to lose the election and destroy this country and its because she refuses to reverse herself on genocide support. She is doing this to herself.
Gaza consistently polls as one of the least important issues for voters. Among voters 18-29 of 16 issues presented in the Harvard IOP polls of that age group, it consistently comes in last or second to last in ratings of importance.
Seems pretty unrealistic to expect politicians to reverse their positions about things very few people care much about.
Neck and neck race. Shes currently sucking up to the NRA gun nuts trying to scrape the bottom of the barrel there. She clearly is scrambling for every possible voter she can without abandoning those sweet sweet AIPAC bribes. I guess we’ll see if you were right on Nov 3rd, and she just didnt flatly need those votes. But there are votes to be had there.
Very, very few. She’s likely to pick up more votes by going on Rogan than reversing herself on support of Israel. If she’s going to do that, it’s likely to occur after, not before, the election.
Harris has a comfortable lead in the electoral college right now.
2016 DNC Campaign literally moments before disaster.
I just came from the utterly brain dead “Harris cares about Gaza” meme post , so I can safely start labeling posts like these as hopium and accepting the status quo.
People really out here thinking the money from the biggest PAC is gonna both allow the dems to win and somehow convince them to actually pass significant legislation to improve literally anything for the middle class beyond token handouts and continuing to repair what Trump destroyed in like only 3 months of hime being in office.
Dunno how Republican turnout is gonna be, but Democrats are about to get a kick in the nuts from all the constituents they willingly chose to ignore. Might still win, but thinking it’s going to be easy is a false hope.
I don’t think anyone is under the illusion this will be easy. Winning will be hard enough but even then there will be massive hurdles to actually being inaugurated.
It’s not comfortable until she hits 270…
That’s a tad old for a president
It’s a weight, not an age. Jordan is talking about their preference in romantic partners
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I wouldn’t count that comfortable in this election. Get her to 200 and the election deniers will have less fuel.
Thanks for reminding me to vote today!
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I’m getting really close to being hopeful that I’m going to be in a swing state. 538 has slowly been showing it in lighter shades of red as we get closer. And the Senate race is polling closer than the last challenger who lost by <3%. If people turn up and vote, there’s a very good chance of excitement
If you can vote early, vote as early as possible. Part of the Democratic mission is to turn out the vote, and if you vote the earliest, we can focus on those who have not yet voted.
We got our ballots here in Colorado area. I plan on researching the ballot measures and filling it out on my leisure, then dropping it off.
God, I love this state! When some dipshit like dementia donnie trashes this great state of ours, it sure does anger me. Every state should have this option for voting, as a for instance.
Get out there and vote, people (or fill out your ballot and mail/drop it off if you have the option)! Like your life depends on it.
Uhhhh that would be voter fraud since I already voted.
Not if it’s knocking doors, offering to drive folks to the polls (where that’s still legal) or handing out water in under served districts with long lines (where that’s still legal)
Hey Dems, stop doomscrolling and go win the election
Im not running this time. Talk to Harris about winning this election.
Remember, if Kamala looses its completely the fault of third party voters and not Kamala’s horrible policies. If Kamala wins then itll be the fault of third party voters why she wont do anything constructive.
I’m so sick of hearing about how she won’t do anything constructive.
Even if that’s true, so what? Who the hell cares?
Who are you going to rent your free room to, the woman who is gonna leave it exactly how you find it, or the guy who’s going to drill holes in the wall to mount the equipment to run his meth lab and store his garbage there for weeks on end? I swear to God, some people have the risk assessment ability of krill making a beeline for a group of whales.
I’m so sick of hearing about how she won’t do anything constructive.
Even if that’s true, so what? Who the hell cares?
I care… deeply. Ineffective milquetoast corporate democrats give more ammunition to right wing extremists… look at decades of weak anti-labor centrists in Europe that are getting pushed out by voters desperate for any change.
Starmer is currently teeing up the UK for some extremist tory by being a centrist labor PM who is unlikely to address any of the people’s pain points.
If democrats actually did shit (and, as an aside, Biden is actually doing shit but is terrible about bragging about it) then the hollow GOP message wouldn’t have a leg to stand on.
Democratic strategists believe your sentiment is the only one and it’s why they keep fucking losing to deplorable candidates.
The vast majority of those deplorable candidates are still losing and Democrats are still pushing forward, albeit PAINFULLY slowly, with a productive agenda. The red wave never happened, and despite the absolutely horrible examples that slipped through like MTG, Republicans are generally NOT winning. All of that goes to hell if we let the ONE apparently “charismatic” one take control again.
You’re right about Starmer. And the people who deeply care in the UK should be working towards building up a viable alternative right now. How many progressive candidates were you helping build a support base for in 2021? How much were you donating to their campaign funds? How much were you canvassing and campaigning and getting names out there?
Right wing extremists do not actually care what Democrats do. If Joe Biden decided to throw out all the immigrants, give everybody assault rifles, and outlaw abortion, and publicly send out bibles, they STILL wouldn’t be on his side, and in fact they may actually entirely flip ideology just to be contradictory. Because Republican supporters, no matter what they say, it isn’t about POLICY for them. It’s about POWER, and you are not going to take away their pursuit of it through more action on EITHER end of the spectrum.
This whole argument reeks like parents who scream at their children when they spill water because “It’s the only way they’ll learn.” The children already know they weren’t supposed to spill that water, and Democrats already know their choices aren’t God’s gift to progressivism. So like that parent, all you’re accomplishing is giving everyone the promise of years of trauma followed by decades of therapy IF they’re lucky enough to make it out on the other side, all so you can feel like you made your position on the spilling of water perfectly clear. I’m sorry, but I don’t find that compelling or reasonable.
I will give you this… I appreciate your HAVING and SPEAKING your opinion, as much as I think it’s nonsense, as opposed to the anonymous downvoting cowards.
I also fucking appreciate real conversations on the internet. I think what we’re talking about isn’t actually that different… my main fear is that underwhelming neoliberalism ends up crushing people so much that fascism emerges as the only other option. Corporate bullshit is extremely dangerous and, up here in Canada, underwhelming Liberal policies in the past year are making it likely that our next prime minister will be a transphobic asshole. It is a frustrating situation to be in because there are real policy decisions we could have made to actually improve living conditions and voter representation and our government just refused to do so… in this coming election our two likely choices are to keep the shitty government in power or switch to the fucking assholes. I prefer the shitty government of course - but this game doesn’t end until the assholes win and each election is more desperate because the Liberals continue to underdeliver.
Anyways yea, I absolutely loathe getting downvoted to oblivion with no conversation and I’m happy to have one with you!
I may disagree with the main thrust of your argument, but I respect that there’s some truth to it, even if in my cynicism I think it’s ideologically unrealistic to expect better, and do agree that it’s a massive disappointment that we can’t get more progress.
Edit: But on the flip side, it is POSSIBLE this isn’t some crappy alternative - this just might be the best we can do. I would like to believe there’s huge support for progressive action that would help people, but I’d also like to believe 50% of my country isn’t Nazis, and that’s also incorrect. If the realistic option is small, frustratingly tiny steps towards positive change, I’ll choose that every time.
She will only win if you vote. Do not say “she’s got this, I’ll skip it.” Do not say “I can’t bring myself to vote for her.” Do not say “something something genocide.” Vote. For. Her.
Because if you don’t, he will win. And you’ll still get the genocide, plus so much other even worse shit.
Do not say “I can’t bring myself to vote for her.” Do not say “something something genocide.” Vote. For. Her.
This… Did not work last time.
Yes it did. I swallowed my pride and voted for Biden. He won. trump was out. Now we have to keep him out.
Last time was Clinton, not Biden. Biden was a completely different situation.
How was last time Clinton? Does Biden not count as a president? You know he won an election and became president right
Harris is way better but we chose her even less than we chose Hillary Clinton. Simply telling people to hold their noses wasn’t as effective as Biden’s campaign.
Except Harris isn’t cringe
Bruh we’re saying “something something genocide”.
That was 2016, “last time” was 2020.
You have a stroke or somethin’?
2020 had Trump as an incumbent, and while people were anxious about Biden’s age nobody was “holding their nose” to vote for him. He was viewed as a less than perfect option that would nevertheless bring normalcy back to the White House as a vanilla corporate Democrat president. That is not, in any way, comparable to the current situation where he’s the incumbent and despised by critical demographics for multiple failed policies whose successor explicitly states she’ll carry over. The last time Democrats had to go around saying “hold your nose and vote blue no matter who” was, indeed, 2016.
So… not voting for her will work better?
She doesn’t “got this.” The election is too close for logic or comfort.
I can’t vote anymore… I already did!
Early voting starts next week for me… I guess my state is just later than all of yalls…
Well I vote by mail and live abroad - my ballot needed time to get to me and then get back to my city clerk.
“playing by the rules? That’s why dems lose!!!”- some ass.
I’m registered and raring to go. I even have the day off, so I’m going. (I’ve voted in every single election)
Don’t vote? Then you don’t get to complain or criticize.
(I’ve voted in every single election)
How old are you??
About 300 years old it seems
Lol my b, in my 30s, so the last 3
You know what they say, “Vote early. Vote often.”
But like, actually do. Because there are a shitload of elections and state + local really matters too.
The fascists must be defeated at every level. It’s like treating cancer. The problem is not over before it’s all gone. And even then there’s a risk of it returning.
Yep. Virginia has it’s statewide position elections on the odd years. So it’s congressional and governor elections tend to have fewer people vote. However, the Dems have gotten wise and have managed to turn out more during these elections.
Take action today! If nothing else it will help with anxiety
Make sure to register to vote. Deadlines are fast approaching in many states
Find opportunities to volunteer for dems around you and online
Write letters to voters in swing states or in competitive downballot races
