The Biden administration will for the first time send controversial armor-piercing munitions containing depleted uranium to Ukraine, according to a document seen by Reuters and separately confirmed by two U.S. officials.

The use of depleted uranium munitions has been fiercely debated, with opponents like the International Coalition to Ban Uranium Weapons saying there are dangerous health risks from ingesting or inhaling depleted uranium dust, including cancers and birth defects.

    • flipht@kbin.social
      0·
      1 year ago

      It’s not about them. It’s the children who find the spent ammo later.

      This crap is the reason that there are birth defects spikes anywhere the US military operates.

      • kitonthenet@kbin.social
        0·
        1 year ago

        Ok but the alternatives are not environmentally conscious either, finally the people who’s land it is should be the ones making choices about the conditions of that land

            • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
              01·
              1 year ago

              That’s a really convenient narrative based on the fallacy of homogenizing Ukraine. Let’s take a look at a few slides from this lecture that Mearsheimer gave back in 2015 to get a bit of background on the subject. Mearsheimer is certainly not pro Russian in any sense, and a proponent of US global hegemony. First, here’s the demographic breakdown of Ukraine:

              here’s how the election in 2004 went:

              this is the 2010 election:

              As we can clearly see from the voting patterns in both elections, the country is divided exactly across the current line of conflict. Furthermore, a survey conducted in 2015 further shows that there is a sharp division between people of eastern and western Ukraine on which economic bloc they would rather belong to:

              Maybe learn a bit about the subject first.

            • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
              01·
              1 year ago

              Russia is obviously not going to withdraw, and you or me asking Russia to withdraw isn’t going to make it happen. However, people living in western countries do have at least some influence on their own regimes. Of course, the reason western regimes can keep the proxy war going is precisely because a lot of scumbags are cheering it on right now.

  • gnuhaut@lemmy.ml
    0·
    1 year ago

    Why though? Can’t imagine that these rounds are going to change the course of the war, so why? Are they out of non-Uranium ones?

  • Big Miku@lemm.eeEnglish
    0·
    1 year ago

    From what I’ve read depleted uranium is not proven to cause cancer, nor is it not proven (With the exception that you inhale it or eat it).

    In Iraq it’s still up to debate if it causes cancer or birth defects, since burning buildings and other burning stuff also causes a lot of nasty things to humans.

    From what I’ve read they were also used in Bosnia, and they haven’t had similiar effects to Iraq.

    So let the Ukrainians have their depleted uranium.

    • rogrodre [none/use name]@hexbear.netEnglish
      0·
      1 year ago

      the International Coalition to Ban Uranium Weapons saying there are dangerous health risks from ingesting or inhaling depleted uranium dust

      Literacy rates in capitalist nations continue to plummet.

      • mintyfrog@lemmy.mlEnglish
        0·
        1 year ago

        If only the world were so simple that we could trust the organization tasked with banning the substance rather than reading primary sources.

        I agree that depleted uranium shouldn’t be used, but your quote from the International Coalition to Ban Uranium Weapons means nothing.

          • Red Wizard 🪄@lemmygrad.ml
            01·
            1 year ago

            That aligns with their chosen reality. People are simple creatures and any money will turn them into obedient slaves. The only doctor you can trust is the one who isn’t going paid because they’ve been ostracized for speaking the truth.

  • Stuka@lemmy.ml
    0·
    1 year ago

    Tankies shaking in their boots over that Abrams 120mm DU APFSDS slicing though Russian steel like butter.

    It’s so easy to trigger tankie bridgades. How many posts yall got about me now? Tagged me in a few!

  • MonkCanatella@sh.itjust.works
    0·
    1 year ago

    OP is known tankie just fyi. Doesn’t justify US or Ukrainian actions but make sure you understand that the reason for posting this isn’t out of any actual concern for human beings. They’re also peddling covid conspiracies

    • ThisMachineKillsFascists [they/them]@hexbear.netEnglish
      0·
      1 year ago

      So let me get this straight, according to you:

      The people that don’t support either side of the war and want to end it as fast as possible through peace talks are evil tankies.

      And the bloodthirsty monsters that want to prolong a pointless war, arm Azov Nazis and kill as many people as possible with illegal inhumane weapons that scar generations are freedom-loving liberals.

      Seems like the tankies are the more reasonable ones in this situation.

  • UraniumBlazer@lemm.eeEnglish
    0·
    1 year ago

    Oh well… The amount of health risks that these rounds would cause would pale in comparison to the mines that the Orcs have planted everywhere. Anything to drive out the invaders!

  • runiq@feddit.de
    01·
    1 year ago

    As a German, thank you. Meanwhile we’re still dragging our feet with the TAURUS, sigh.

  • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
    14·
    1 year ago

    Just another piece of evidence that the west never actually cared about Ukraine or people living there. Ukrainians are just a pawn the west is using to try and weaken Russia with zero consideration for the lives of the people living there.

    • ExLisper@linux.communityEnglish
      0·
      1 year ago

      Good thing Russia cared enough to murder, rape and kidnap them. What would Ukrainians do without help from great Putin?

          • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
            01·
            1 year ago

            The west literally overthrew the legitimate and democratically elected government to install literal fascists in power who have been busy doing this the people in eastern Ukraine for the past either years. If this is news to you then take a sit because you have no clue regarding the subject you’re bloviating on here.

    • Cethin@lemmy.zipEnglish
      0·
      1 year ago

      Well, the alternatives are heavy metal, which also aren’t the greatest to breathe in. It’s almost like war is aweful and this one shouldn’t have been started in the first place, but here we are…

        • bibibi@lemmy.ml
          0·
          1 year ago
          1. if Ukraine lose completely most of ukrainans living in Ukraine simply get extriminated or forcely assimilated.
          2. Russia started the war when invided Ukraine in 2014. not sure where the “using” is.
        • photonic_sorcerer@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
          0·
          1 year ago

          And what, let the Russians steamroll Ukraine and take everything? Let them destroy a fledgling democracy? Right on the EU’s and NATO’s doorstep? Come on.

          • fuckiforgotmypasswor [comrade/them,any]@hexbear.netEnglish
            1·
            1 year ago

            let the Russians steamroll Ukraine and take everything?

            I’ve noticed that every pro-NATO voice screaming “war good” has to pretend like the binary outcome of this war is a) Ukraine becomes Russia and every living inhabitant is genocided (see above comment from bibibi for case in point), or b) Ukraine heroically drives back Russia with magic in a completely asymmetrical and unwinnable war

            Come on.

            And then finishes their comment with something like this

            There’s no material analysis to support any of this

            The only way to get to that viewpoint is to believe Putin is an irrational, genocidal maniac hellbent on killing checks notes neighbors who are ethnically russian, who also desperately wants to push even more of Russia’s border right up against a hostile NATO. It’s no surprise that the people saying this shit are pro NATO and don’t understand the material reality underlying geopolitical conflicts like this one

            Not gonna touch the “fledgeling democracy” thing, other comrades can dunk on that chefs-kiss

        • Cethin@lemmy.zipEnglish
          0·
          1 year ago

          The real alternative is for Russians to go home. Who the fuck cares who’s using them? They’re being invaded. Russia didn’t need to invade them, but they thought they could get away with it (again). This isnt the first invasion of a sovereign country Russia has done. It isn’t even the first invasion of Ukraine. The US didn’t get involved in the others. Are we just going to excuse those?

          • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
            01·
            1 year ago

            I don’t know why people keep repeating this. Do you honestly think this is a coherent point? Russia is obviously not going to go home no matter how many times you’re going to repeat it. It’s a meaningless and useless statement that literally solves nothing. Either NATO can defeat Russia or not, so far it looks like NATO is not able to do so. What NATO is accomplishing is prolonging the conflict without changing the outcome. That means more people dying and having their lives ruined so that US military industry can make a profit and so that US can try and weaken Russia geopolitically. Anybody who thinks the west is in this conflict to help Ukraine is an utter imbecile.

            • Cethin@lemmy.zipEnglish
              0·
              1 year ago

              Should the US have sent supplies to the allies in WWI and WWII before joining? It was just prolonging the war and causing people to die, right?

              The reason the US is doing it is not morality. Everyone knows that. International politics is never about morality, it’s about power. However, that doesn’t mean it isn’t also the moral option.

              Also, NATO and the US are not in the war. We’re sending supplies. The US isn’t even sending the good stuff. We’re sending parts of our stockpile that’s old and has just been sitting around waiting for a use. They haven’t sent the newer technology so it it isn’t studied in case a real enemy requires them to be used.

              • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
                01·
                1 year ago

                It takes an incredible amount of historical illiteracy to try and draw parallels between WW2 and the proxy war US is waging against Russia in Ukraine. However, if you weren’t historically illiterate, then you’d also know that US companies continued working with the nazis well into the war, and IBM is famously responsible for facilitating the holocaust.

                Also, NATO and the US are very obviously in this war, and one has to be utterly intellectually dishonest to pretend otherwise.

                • Cethin@lemmy.zipEnglish
                  01·
                  1 year ago

                  When the US government was providing resources to the allies, was it good or bad? I’m not talking companies or anything else. You’re dodging the question. There are enough parallels to draw a comparison. You just know what the answer would be and it conflicts with your beliefs, so you can’t admit it, to yourself or others.

    • barsoap@lemm.ee
      0·
      1 year ago

      Russia does not need the west to weaken it, comrade, it is perfectly capable of doing that on its own!

        • barsoap@lemm.ee
          0·
          1 year ago

          You expect me to pay for an article from a neolib shitstain outlet?

          Have another neolib shitstain outlet, this time for free: https://www.businessinsider.com/russian-economy-brain-drain-labor-shortage-workforce-exodus-capital-flight-2023-9

          The truth is that it’s all quite hard to measure as Russia is lying about its economical figures (they make no sense whatsoever) and going via secondary indicators is possible, but also frought with uncertainty. But two things really stand out: a) investing in a war you’re losing is GDP flushed down the drain, b) they’re cut off from any advanced technology at even half-way reasonable prices, c) massive brain drain, there’s also d) report of very excessive inflation when it comes to food.

          If they manage to raise GDP by exporting more oil or whatnot – that’s raising GDP. It’s not actually doing the country any good. More petrorubles for the kleptocrats.

          But all that is rather besides the point. Russia, alongside with Ukraine, did a lot of stuff wrong in the 90s. Look at Estonia or e.g. Czechs (if you want to keep it among Slavs) on how to do it… nah, not right, but definitely better.

          Ukraine then managed to turn around, develop an actual civil society and clip the wings of the oligarchy, Russia didn’t. That is what I mean with “perfectly capable of messing up on their own”. It’s also the reason for the war it’s a matter of regime stability: There’s plenty of family ties between Russia and Ukraine, if Russians see that Ukraine can escape the yoke of the kleptocrats then they could start to believe that they, too, can do that.

          • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
            01·
            1 year ago

            I expect you to have minimal technical literacy to put the link URL in archive.

            The truth is that there is no actual evidence to indicate that Russian economy is struggling in any way.

            a) investing in a war you’re losing is GDP flushed down the drain

            That certainly explains why Europe is in a deep recession now and why US economy is looking shaky.

            b) they’re cut off from any advanced technology at even half-way reasonable prices

            Once you look at a map you’ll realize that Russia shares a huge border with China where all the advanced technology is produced nowadays. Trade between Russia and China has shot up to over 200 billion this year.

            c) massive brain drain

            Very little evidence for that actually happening, the article you linked is written by the same people who claimed Russia was a gas station with nukes, and that Russian economy was going to collapse months after western sanctions were imposed. If you haven’t figured out that you’ve been lied to yet, that really says a lot about you.

            d) report of very excessive inflation when it comes to food.

            Russia has very low food inflation and happens to be one of the major food producers globally. Once again, the fact that you think Russia has food inflation says volumes.

            But all that is rather besides the point. Russia, alongside with Ukraine, did a lot of stuff wrong in the 90s. Look at Estonia or e.g. Czechs (if you want to keep it among Slavs) on how to do it… nah, not right, but definitely better.

            We’re now seeing Russia having made it through two years of being cut off from the western economy, and doing well for itself. Meanwhile, countries like Estonia and Czech republic aren’t doing so hot. And frankly, it’s completely absurd to compare a country the size of Russia to a country like Estonia.

            Ukraine then managed to turn around, develop an actual civil society and clip the wings of the oligarchy, Russia didn’t.

            That’s complete and utter horseshit. Ukraine turned into the most corrupt country in Europe, and things have only kept getting worse. Ukraine started as a big industrial power after USSR collapsed, and now it’s been robbed entirely of anything of value.

            There’s plenty of family ties between Russia and Ukraine, if Russians see that Ukraine can escape the yoke of the kleptocrats then they could start to believe that they, too, can do that.

            What people in Russia see is that under west’s leadership Ukraine managed to become worse than Russia. All that did was convince people in Russia that the west was going to fuck them over exactly the same way they fucked Ukraine over.

            • barsoap@lemm.ee
              0·
              1 year ago

              Ukraine turned into the most corrupt country in Europe, and things have only kept getting worse.

              Ukraine and Russia both did. One of them is making efforts to get out of that swamp.

              I find it rather telling that of all the things you found weak retorts for, you completely left out the “More petrorubles for the kleptocrats” part, and how GDP is not a proper measure of the wealth of a people, at least in any even remotely leftist sense.

              Ask Tuvans without access to electricity, running water, heck even a fucking gas station, how wealthy they are. Yet they’re not even counted as poor in the official statistics as the way poverty is counted in Russia is highly regional: If you’re poor in Moscow you count, if you’re infinitely worse off in the periphery you don’t.

              That is why you see Russian soldiers – primarily from the periphery as joining the army is the only way to make any money as there’s no actual jobs – looting toilets. Fucking toilets. Back in WWII it was water faucets. Nothing the fuck has changed in that regard.

              If you think that Putin is “draining the swamp” then you’re no less naive than your run off the mill Trumpet.

              (Side note, speaking of WWII: Remember that Soviet flag on the Reichstag picture? That’s of a Ukrainian. Taken by a Ukrainian).

              • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
                01·
                1 year ago

                One of them is making efforts to get out of that swamp.

                You must be referring to Russia here given that this is what’s happening in Ukraine right now

                I find it rather telling that of all the things you found weak retorts for, you completely left out the “More petrorubles for the kleptocrats” part, and how GDP is not a proper measure of the wealth of a people, at least in any even remotely leftist sense.

                There is zero indication to suggest that regular people in Russia are significantly effected in any way right now. Cost of food, housing, and other essentials has stayed stable.

                That is why you see Russian soldiers – primarily from the periphery as joining the army is the only way to make any money as there’s no actual jobs – looting toilets. Fucking toilets. Back in WWII it was water faucets. Nothing the fuck has changed in that regard.

                I mean if that’s what you’ve convinced yourself of then what else is there to say to you.

                If you think that Putin is “draining the swamp” then you’re no less naive than your run off the mill Trumpet.

                No, I don’t think Putin is draining any swamp, but I do think he runs a far more competent administration than western oligarchs.

                (Side note, speaking of WWII: Remember that Soviet flag on the Reichstag picture? That’s of a Ukrainian. Taken by a Ukrainian).

                And now thanks to the help from the west Ukraine is run by literal fascists. Maybe something you should reflect on.

                In any case, this conversation is clearly pointless since you evidently live in an alternate reality. I’ll just let you figure things out on your own and reconcile the fantasies you’ve built up with the real world as it becomes increasingly more difficult to ignore going forward.

  • PowerCrazy@lemmy.ml
    03·
    1 year ago

    I’m just glad that as an Adult in the room, I’m on the right side of history. Arming Ukranian Nazis with depleted uranium is actually the least evil option and anyone who doesn’t understand that is a child.

    Another 50 billion for the cause!

    • realharo@lemm.ee
      0·
      1 year ago

      And you know how the Vietnam war ended, right?

      There was a peace agreement between the north and the south, and then a few years later North Vietnam broke it and invaded again, taking over all of the country.

        • realharo@lemm.ee
          0·
          1 year ago

          So basically admitting you don’t know the actual history? Maybe start with reading a Wikipedia page or something.

          None of that excuses US war crimes in Vietnam, but it does show how a potential future with a hypothetical peace treaty could look like.