We have yet another example of the conservatives having only short term gain and quick profits on their mind. Turner and the liberals were right when they said that we have been building this country east to west for a century plus, and that we should have continued doing so. And now we are seeing Turner’s predictions coming true, and a conservative sold us the fuck out and took the easy way Instead of nation building.
I’m not conflating anything, I’m telling you to stop worrying about the candidate you dont like and demand your preferred candidate make a case on why they are worth putting the effort on showing up for to people who dont give a shit about politics. my examples were of what not to fucking do, and you immediately start doing a few of them. good job.
the US liberals (harris/biden/pelosi/schumer,etc) and those like them (you) think you can brow beat people into compliance by fear of conservatives and that doesnt work. all it does it cause people to tune you out and then ignore the election entirely.
Why are you trying to conflate Canadian Liberals and the Democrats? They aren’t remotely the same party, the systems of government don’t look anything alike and they aren’t in cahoots.
And the Canadian Conservatives are fronting a guy who has stated his support of American style “Right to Work” legislation and other Americanizing government initiatives who went into politics immediately from going to school for international affairs against a guy who has spent years as Governor of two National Central Banks and created a number of international contacts across the Commonwealth in the international financial sector that can be leveraged and yet Conservatives are trying to paint themselves as “better for the economy”. Pollievre has been utilizing anti gay anti queer dogwhistles in his rhetoric for the past ever as well. Fuck Right to Work bullshit and fuck anybody who wants to roll back civil protections. There’s not a lot of places in the world as safe as Canada for queer people to exist so it’s not like there’s much better places to escape once the fortress falls.
The CPC and UCP are pretty awful for sure. But as this thread demonstrates, conservatives do not have a monopoly on bad takes, divisive rhetoric, unnecessary hostility, and self-defeating attitudes.
And the parallels between Democrats and LPC are significant. Both have an establishment that isn’t genuinely interested in tackling certain problems or backing away from a still generally pro-business bias. Aside from some key fundamentals we can credit for upholding this difference, many of the practical differences between Canada and the U.S. are more in degree than nature – i.e. money in politics, corporate welfare, influence of traditional energy, (mostly provincial) industrial barons, etc.
Admittedly the Liberals are not my party of choice but there still is validity for voting for the lesser of two bad options. Until we can address the first past the post system we are beholden to voting more against than for a given regime by reaching a sort of mutual concensus with our neighbours before we hit the polls. That representive voting system needs to happen elsewise we’re stuck playing this dumb game.
But it’s hard to compare even this party I am not terribly enthusiastic to to the Democrats when there’s at least mediocre commitments to a number of decent causes toward reconciliation, reasonable commitment to the Kyoto climate accord targets, stated support of LGBTQIA+ causes and at least a lukewarm support of Palistine mostly expressed through refugee programs and a spineless condemnation of the atrocities and a recognition of two state authorities in the region. There’s also a much more robust court culture and a wider swath of people in the party who at least demonstrate a desire for a properly pluralistic, secular society.
It’s more useful to veiw the parties based on how they talk within their own parties because it’s not a presidential situation. There’s less unilateral moves to be made as a PM without party support is a lame horse. While I wish we would see wider endorsement of the NDP it’s not traditionally a popular party in the field and there’s way more swing between Libs and Conservatives.
The Liberals are trying their best to find a tasty middle ground for the “fiscal Conservative voter” to bite because strategy reasons. They put forward a candidate who is Albertan, Catholic, an outsider to politics with a lot of financial sector ties who pulls quotes from the era of the Quiet revolution and balancing government budgets for the discerning blue voter while the more leftist ones can chew on his ringing of alarm bells of wealth inequality, climate change and the lack of application of morals in the markets. He’s been largely silent on 2SLGBTQIA+ issues which while always a little unsettling the previous admin left on a very openly queer friendly stance so while again, not ideal, all that currently is needed at present is just not undoing what’s been done and supporting the stuff already in progress.
Is he everything we’ve dreamed? Not really. But it shows they are trying to build out a solid concensus candidate that a broad range of people can stomach.
I would consider the various issues you describe are as fair examples of what I described: difference in magnitude rather than kind. The Democrats pay many of those same values lip service – or at least did, before thinking this time maybe their problem is the lip service rather than miniscule action. In no way do I mean to imply that those differences in magnitude are marginal. By magnitude I mean you could relatively score them by moving decimal points.
But I want to conclude with what I think is my most important point/position. I’m fully on board the LPC train this round. Electoral reform is my longstanding top issue, but the disaster down south and the clear path Canada has through it easily displace that (for now). Heck, the CPC threat had me struggling with my vow to never vote LPC under Trudeau until someone delivered electoral reform. If a Carney-led LPC gave us proper electoral reform, I could end up considering LPC a very long-term top option rather than strategic defense. But considering the dangerous optics of repeating Trudeau’s broken promise, I don’t even want it mentioned right now.
Right now its 💯 elbows up.
Man… we’ve been doing this for decades. Where did that get us?
Better than voting for the greater of two bad options. What needs to be done is change the system to allow good options more easily, but in the mean time letting the worst options run amok isn’t going to help anything.
This problem can’t be solved by voting alone, but not voting will make it worse.
Amen brother. That’s the real source of the problem right there.
I’m not. I’m telling you that running a campaign on nothing other than ‘not that guy’ is a recipe for a disaster.
Do. not. fall. into. that. trap.
its a trap this entire thread demostrates people are actively falling into.
You are literally describing the fucking conservatives with that. Their entire fucking campaign leading up to this moment was: WeRe NoT JusTiN. Lmao
step 1: stop worrying about what the other candidate is doing.
step 2: make a case why how your candidate is going to improve the lives of your fellow citizens.
step 3: success.
I see you still don’t understand step 1.
??? You guys already starting the misinformation station? Gtfo of here and grow up.
What he’s asking is pretty basic and on point. You’re yelling at people to vote for a party that has failed Canadians in the past 10 years and people aren’t exactly convinced that the new guy will bring about any change that will significantly improve their lives.
So why don’t you try to convince us? What are your arguments for voting for them?
The preferred candidate for Canada ATM is Mark Carney. Period. You wanna be a whiney little bitch keyboard warrior go right ahead and continue blaming all your problems on the government
Please change your tone. There’s no need for insults here.
preferred to whom. anyways good luck you’re going to need it.
Preferred to Canada??? The entire nation? Obviously If the riding you’re in is a CPC/NDP battle ground you should vote NDP, and if it’s a LPC/CPC battleground then you shouldn’t vote split and go liberal. This is very basic shit. Grow up.
What’re you gonna say next? that because trump said he would prefer dealing with a liberal that it’s true?