There’s a lesson to be learned here:
Remove lead? Industry fights it. Lead gets removed. Industry is fine.
Acid rain? Industry fights it. Sulfur dioxide emissions reduced. Industry is fine.
Hole in ozone layer? Industry fights it. PFCs removed. Industry just fine.
Global warming? Industry fights it…
But the industry WASN’T fine. They lost a fraction of a fraction of a percent in profits by going for the cleaner, safer options. How can you be so heartless.
Clearly nobody has thought about the corpo parasite mate…
There is an issue of scale in that series. The first three are relatively small cost fixes. Addressing global climate change requires fundamentally reconfiguring all industry, globally at the very least. That’s orders of magnitude more costly than the first three fixes. And it’s orders of magnitude more difficult to get done politically, and engineering-wise.
But beyond that it may require massive reductions in consumption, trade and transportation. Possibly even short term remediation efforts like sprinkling silver dust in the stratosphere, which is estimated to cost in the hundred trillion dollar range.
I like that your comment shows that progress can be made against entrenched powerful interests though.
Nope all it requires is a tax on greenhouse gas emissions, that’s it.
So no one has to change anything physically? Just tax and poof? Neat trick.
Here’s the Wikipedia article on carbon tax it’s quite positive about it
Looks around at the trump world… yep
Yup. About half of them voted this last election.
And they vote.
Over 75 years, Hauer said lead exposure doubled the risk of schizophrenia for 89 million Americans, while quadrupling the risk of attention deficit disorder (ADHD) among another 170 million U.S. adults. The research also found a spike in anxiety, depression and neuroticism and a decrease in conscientiousness over the same period.
The authors note that lead exposures would have also occurred from lead pipes, contaminated food and soil, and airborne dust from lead-emitting industries and waste incineration, among other sources. However, all of the mental health disorders tracked in the study rose and fell with the prevalence of lead in gasoline.
I guess this explains Boomers
Gen X voted for Trump in greater numbers. We need to admit that half of Americans just fucking suck in general.
Gen X was still knee deep in lead emissions.
Also, both groups have had a stranglehold on mainstream media, normalizing their sociopathy for the next generations.
For the record, less than a third of eligible voters voted for Trump.
Fair enough, a third of Americans are fascists and a third are too beaten down or stupid to care.
Honestly, as much as I’m grieved and angered by what the world is right now, I find it really hard to fault the average person for choosing ignorance in the face of the monstrous realities of everyday modernity. I know that things could be so much better, and I want them to see it too, and fight for it. (Thus why I made my account on slrpnk.net.)
But, it feels unfair for me to expect something of them that they may be unequipped to handle mentally and/or emotionally. Perhaps I’m just too nice—and perhaps that’s the burden of having a big heart. Or perhaps I’m just too weak, and tough love would be more caring. I’m still figuring it out myself. 💔
Possibly accurate.
Half of Americans refused to vote for either genocidal maniac.
I’m more worried about the other half, both Red & Blue MAGA, who wouldn’t even draw the line at genocide.
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Nahh bro my team is good, trust me bro, just vote for my guy and it will fix your problems!
Rheee
Democracy dies in darkness 🤡
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NTs aren’t running the world. Workaholic sociopaths are running the world.
NDs are becoming more and more socially accepted, and less willing to subjugate themselves. “Neurodivergent” seems to be a misnomer: NTs only seem to be “typical” when NDs closet themselves and try to emulate them.
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The cases are on average more extreme now though.
My dad’s full side is ADHD/ASD. But the millennials/genZs have more severe cases than their uncles and great uncles did.
You can look at all the related disorders that are often comorbid like autoimmune, thyroid, MCAS, etc.
Look at conditions like Type1 diabetes which is growing ~3% per year! This isn’t just better diagnostics but explained by the stress diathesis model of disease interacting with our modern synthetic world.
The cases are on average more extreme now though
This is based on your personal experience and not the evidence, which does not bear that out
Please present this evidence that rules what I said out.
Took 2s to find this
https://fortune.com/well/2023/04/19/rate-of-profound-autism-rising-not-as-fast-as-milder-cases/
That article doesn’t say what you seem to think it says. It only talks about an increase in diagnosed cases, which can be explained away by more frequent assessments, better awareness of symptoms, the loosening of diagnostic criteria in the DSM IV, and over-diagnosis to get children with other severe developmental disorders qualified for services. There are lots of reasons we know about that autism is being diagnosed more frequently, but the best you’re going to get on your hypothesis is “we don’t know.”
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-real-reasons-autism-rates-are-up-in-the-u-s/
Experts say the bulk of the increase stems from a growing awareness of autism and changes to the condition’s diagnostic criteria.
https://www.annualreviews.org/content/journals/10.1146/annurev.publhealth.28.021406.144007
Environmental risk factors may also play a role, perhaps via complex gene-environment interactions, but no specific exposures with significant population effects are known
https://www.autismspeaks.org/autism-statistics-asd
Autism prevalence is lower among white children than other racial and ethnic groups:
White – 2.4%, Black – 2.9%, Hispanic – 3.2%, Asian or Pacific Islander – 3.3%
These changes reflect an improvement in outreach, screening and de-stigmatization of autism diagnosis among minority communities.
People also get a lot better at masking as they get older so younger people’s autism appears more severe than older people’s. Same is probably true for ADHD
Routine treatment for autism, that would be something.
I agree with you though.
Routine treatment for autism is applied behavior analysis. While ABA has its origins a hundred years ago, the field as it currently exists is very new, having really only developed in the last 25 years
Good to know. I’ve never heard of it and it’s not a thing in my country.
It’s not whether it existed or not, it’s the prevalence of it. Nothing wrong with it of course.
Neither the greeks nor the romans were particularly shy about it and… Let’s call it non-christian ideas about sex have cropped up at various places and various times in history. That’s before the invention of plastics, so it got to be some good proof to be able to point a clear finger away from culture and towards plastics.
Women with ADHD went so underdiagnosed that it’s considered an epidemic.
Women over the age of 35 were straight up not diagnosed because “girls don’t get ADHD.” So I do somewhat disagree with your premise.
Under that age, too… Just turned 30 this year, still working my way around to doing research to find a provider to diagnose me. Which, with the nature of the condition that could take… a while, ha.
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it makes me wonder how neurotypical people ended up running the world
Unless you’re being sarcastic, this is absolutely not the case.
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I see; I think we just had different definitions of “running the world.” I thought you meant literally the leaders of nations, but you meant setting the social conventions of society at large.
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there are all kinds of hidden social requirements, everything happens during the day
That’s how you optimize the oprhan crushing machine…
Surely nerodivergent person can appreciate a good optimization game?
Yeah, I wouldn’t call narcissists neurotypical.
it’ll probably be the ‘forever chemicals’ (e.g. pfas) but yea, same deal.
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Society also had odd little release valves for neurodivergents which bizarrely enough could include parts of the military. Most of those are gone though in exchange at least we get treatment more readily than back then
There was a recent Australian study that found a link between BPAs and autism, although I find it hard to believe there’s a 1-to-1 link, as autism was a thing before plastics were invented.
Have you met these people IRL or online? Most of the people I’ve met online do fall into one of those two buckets, but almost nobody I’ve met IRL does.
I would assume this is selection bias before attributing it to some other thing. The kinds of circles you run in are going to heavily affect this.
I’m not sure the typical part is so typical after all. Given the size and complexity of our brains and the difference in DNA between us, I think more or less every family has their own ways of thinking and acting.
This is why boomers hate their children.
151 million? That number seems low to me…
I think that’s about the amount of people who were are currently alive, that had been born by the time leaded gas was banned, maybe a little bit less.
Don’t aircraft still use leaded fuel to this day?
So uh, there was some studying being done at my local university about mapping health issues for residents living closer to airports and… It ain’t too great. :(
That’s probably related to all the other chemicals they use at airports (eg forever chemicals in fire retardant). 100LL (100 octane low lead) is only used in small piston engines, which is a very small population. They’re trying alternatives that don’t use lead, but I’m reading that the top contender is eating through paint and possibly gaskets and seals in the plane, which isn’t safe either.
Yeah, fuels are funny like that, rocket fuel kept dissolving chunks of ground crew for the longest time
I can’t tell if this is a joke or legit lmao
A bit hyperbolic but seriously, look up hypergolic propellants.
Only some small piston based aircraft engines. Commercial aviation doesn’t use lead. It’s not great, but it’s not a particularly significant amount.
Jet aircraft use jet fuel(more refined Kerosene).
Yes. My boomer father drives to airports to get leaded gas for his lawn equipment and generators. He thinks I’m over reacting when I refuse to be near any of that shit when it’s running.
Wonder what we’ll find out the lunchables have done to us.
do you have eyes?
like how is that news? we see them all the time.
I had trouble understanding the standard deviations in the study so had chatgpt translate them into terms I could understand.
FYI:
-
General Psychopathology Factor (g-factor):
- The “602-million General Psychopathology factor points” refers to the cumulative impact of leaded gasoline exposure across the U.S. population on a mental health risk measure.
- A 0.13 standard deviation increase means that, on average, the population’s liability to mental illness shifted slightly higher. While it’s hard to translate standard deviations into percentages directly, a 0.13 SD is considered a small effect, equivalent to about a 5.2% increase in risk when interpreted broadly.
-
151 Million Excess Mental Disorders:
- This means that, due to lead exposure, there were 151 million additional cases of mental disorders in the U.S. population over time. This doesn’t mean 151 million people, as some individuals might have more than one disorder.
-
Internalizing Symptoms:
- Internalizing symptoms (like anxiety and depression) showed a 0.64 standard deviation increase. This is a medium-to-large effect size and can be roughly understood as a 24% increase in these symptoms across the population.
-
AD/HD Symptoms:
- Attention-Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder symptoms increased by 0.42 standard deviations, which is a moderate effect size. This corresponds to about a 16.5% increase in population-level AD/HD symptoms.
-
Personality Traits (Neuroticism and Conscientiousness):
- Neuroticism (tendency to experience negative emotions) increased by 0.14 standard deviations (a small effect, about a 5.6% increase).
- Conscientiousness (self-discipline and organization) decreased by 0.20 standard deviations, which is a slightly larger small effect, about an 8% decrease.
-
Not sure if this is offtopic but…
My parents grew up in China but still emotionally abusive af, did China also have leaded gasoline, or did the wind just blew all the toxicity of lead from the US all the way across the world? (None of us even stepped foot in the US until like around 2010s, I think leaded gas was already banned by then…) 🤔
Or maybe my parents are just naturally born toxic… 😓
China didn’t ban it until 2000.
It’s still legal in like Afghanistan and North Korea.
Japan was the first to ban it in 1986.
Edit: to answer your question more accurately, any country with vehicles that had engines prone to knocking had it. So yes, it was very much in the atmosphere of China.
I was born after 2000 so I guess I’m fine? Does lead poisoning get passed down?
Yea I think my parents just have lead poisoning and that why they be toxic af.
My brother born before 2000 has weird racist views and conspiracy theories. Is that the lead poisoning manifesting?
While the lead poisoning wouldn’t cause the toxic thinking, racism, and belief in conspiracy theories - it would have made them much more susceptible to it from those around them.
Like all good science, correlation does not imply causation. However, we do know that lead does accumulate in brain tissue, and we can see that the rise of lead in the atmosphere had a very strong correlation with violent crime, and the reduction of it reduced violent crime. This study and IQ show the relationship as well.
We’re all still being affected by this to some extent. Effectively by putting it in the gas and burning it, we also spread it though out the environment. Obviously not as bad as rawdawging the fumes themselves like the lead head boomer and genexers, but it’s in the dust of the world you live in. You are doing way better than the generations previously. Interestingly, the generations looking to roll back the kind of regulations that protected you are the ones most affected by the lead (boomer, Gen x).
I think lead poisoning is a cope so we can all get over that boomers “naturally” hate their children
They used lead for sure, but there might have been fewer cars depending on where they lived.
Lead is probably one of the least bad things you’ve inhaled if you lived in a Chinese large or industrial city between 2000 and 2024. So you’re likely tainted as well. Sorry.
We all still get mercury from the food because many countries still allow burning waste/garbage in outdated plants without proper smoke cleaning installed. And then it spreads through the atmosphere and gets into the local food cycle when it rains. This effect is global. That’s why you shouldn’t eat fish from lakes if you’re pregnant etc. Doesn’t matter where you live.
You still have exposure even with wind.
The time frames seem a bit odd in their study and the most affected being born as late as 1986. Mainly because most vehicles in the US in the 1970’s ran on unleaded fuel already (ford didnt build a leaded vehicle past 74 or 75) and cars from the 70’s were lucky to be on the road a decade later. I would have thought the most effected would have been pre 1980. The US may not have banned it until 1996, but by that point 99% of cars touching the roads were already lead free.
Is there any similar study done on hunters or people who eat meat from animals shot with lead bullets? Sometimes I wonder if lead from bullets make gun slingers and game meat eaters more retarded. I.e. MAGA folks basically.
Lead from bullets in wild game are a non issue generally. It’s not staying in the animal long enough to leech out.
However, casting your own bullets from spent ones without proper safety equipment(happens WAY more than you’d think, especially amongst prepper types), handling them a lot and not washing your hands after, and generally being exposed to lead dust IS a problem.
I hate that I know all that, but being in an unfortunate proximity to those types of individuals has taught me a lot.
Yes, that happens for sure. I did look into making my own ammunition, but it’s just not worth it. Even though ammunition is really expensive nowadays.
Also, I’ve only been using non-lead bullets for non-practice. But I wouldn’t dare tell the old guys. ;-)
Most older experienced hunters I know did cast their own practice ammo at some point in their life. Probably on their kitchen table without any safety equipment.
Making your own is worthwhile for oddball loads and custom rounds for rifle, and some pistol ammo. Something like 9mm just isn’t worth the time anymore after the cost of primers and powder more than doubled. I’ve been casting and loading for a bit over 10 years. Definitely want to wash your hands well after you finish, and no eating or drinking while you work. A little lead exposure doesn’t worry me, all my years working in labs around concentrated chemicals and drug actives are much more likely to cause me issues as I get older.
That wouldn’t be enough to cause real damage tbh.
Lead is toxic but you still need quite a bit of it and it’s absorbed wildly differently based on medium. That’s why the Romans could have lead pipes that were mostly not that dangerous due to their water being very hard while leaded gasoline used tetraethyl lead which is more potent and it’s inhaled rather than ingested.
Basically eating/drinking lead contaminated resources only give you like 1-10% of the actual poison while inhaling gives you the full 100%
You’re correct. The risk is there, but it’s not high.
It has been known for centuries that lead is toxic to humans. Chronic exposure to lead, even at low levels, is associated with an elevated risk of cardiovascular and chronic kidney disease in adults and of impaired neurodevelopment and subsequent cognitive and behavioural development in the foetus and young children. Health agencies throughout the world have moved from assuming that there are tolerable levels of exposure to lead to a recognition that valid ‘no-effect’ thresholds cannot currently be defined. Formerly, the most important exposure pathways were occupational exposure, water from lead plumbing, paints, petrol additives and foods. Regulation of products and improved health and safety procedures at work have left dietary lead as the main remaining pathway of exposure in European countries. Ammunition-derived lead is now a significant cause of dietary lead exposure in groups of people who eat wild game meat frequently. These are mostly hunters, shoot employees and their families, but also some people who choose to eat game for ethical, health or other reasons, and their children. Extrapolation from surveys conducted in the UK and a review of studies of game consumption in other countries suggest that approximately 5 million people in the EU may be high-level consumers of lead-shot game meat and that tens of thousands of children in the EU may be consuming game contaminated with ammunition-derived lead frequently enough to cause significant effects on their cognitive development.
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6675757/
Apparently, the human stomach dissolves small bullet fragments of metallic lead. That’s probably bad.
Experiments of solubility showed that lead fragments from bullets dissolve in chlo- ric acid of the same concentration as in the stomach of humans
You don’t need lead.
Romans did develop lead toxicity but it was delayed because of the calcium salts in the hard water making a preventive layer. Which made leaching of the lead difficult.
“need quite a bit of it”… to be poisoned. There’s context my dude.
Sorry didn’t get that.
No problem, cheers!
Lol painting with a pretty broad brush there, ain’cha?
Maybe research your hypothesis a bit before you wildly lump sustenance hunters, omnivores, and gun owners as being “[stupid] MAGA folks basically” by default because they’ve…(flips papers)…‘Handled ammunition before.’ lol
I’m all about big brushes.
Dipped in diarrhea…
Preferably.
