If I steal food from the store, I’m both robbing the store, and a community that would have paid good money for that food.
If I go to the store and magically have the items on the shelves be duplicated into my cart, and I don’t have to pay for them. That is not a crime that is a miracle
Consider this. (big chain) Stores already steal from the community via profits they make.
And while we’re on about food, look at how much the grocery stores toss out.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Theft is theft.
No, but three lefts make a right!
You are goddamn right!
Didn’t ask for your meaningless sayings that do not apply to real life
Exactly true, and as applied to patents: if I steal your fish you go hungry, if I watch how you fish and do the same we both eat.
bruh
Also if buying isn’t owning than wtf did I buy. In any other time period this corporate shit would be considered a scam.
Also if buying isn’t owning than wtf did I buy.
“Access.” It is such a scam.
You didn’t buy anything, we rent now…
Landlords everywhere, even on the internet… It’s disgusting. They get to own, we get to borrow…
So to OP, it’s still stealing as they own everything, we just rent. Fucking scam for sure :(
Honestly, land should be considered a utility
At the risk of sounding like a landlord here, there are far wealthier people to be disgusted by.
Gates quietly buying as much arable land as he can in the world.
False dichotomy, I’m disgusted by both.
Yeah, I think it’s backwards to still focus our ire on “landlords” when it’s oligarch (yes, some of whom are also landlords) that are the real enemy.
In modern society, many landlords are just middle-class folks who bought an apartment building as their retirement fund.
“YoU BoUgHt a lIcEnSe tO UsE ThE PrOdUcT”
Funny how the word license never comes up until you read the fine print. Colloquially you’re buying the product. If we’re going by legal technicalities then legally I ain’t stealing shit.
You bought the right to give them money! :D
You are renting the software forever, until it’s no longer supported (I’m looking at you Nintendo)
The same thing as when you buy a movie ticket.
If you “buy” a massage you don’t then own a massage. Lol. Doesn’t matter what time period.
Services like massages are paying directly for someone’s active labor, buying a book, a song, or an (offline) game is one a time transaction for an already completed work
What you’re paying for when there’s a license or other kind of agreement is more akin to a service. Like permission to use it, renting it. Paying for labor is just renting someone’s body and skills. The seller making the offer gets to determine the terms, and then you have just as much power to walk away.
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I don’t agree with some of that stuff.
How do you know before you read the entire argument? 🤔
I don’t agree with some of that stuff.
How do you know before you read the entire argument?
By reading some of it, I suppose.
read the linked text if you are interested in debating me 😁😂🤣😅 I am not gonna make the same argument but worse than proudhon if you don’t care or have time or attention span for that but then you probably shouldn’t say it’s bullshit without knowing what you are talking about 😘
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No. The first argument is that the author can equate slavery to murder without being misunderstood. They then expound further on that meaning. They say nothing about wages.
The second argument says that in contrast one cannot equate property to robbery without being grossly misunderstood, which you have so eloquently demonstrated.
No, it is from a 19th century socialist, this sort of language isn’t easily understood by most people in the modern day. And to act like it should be so insightful to them is sophistry.
I’m not taking offense that they didn’t understand the argument. I’m taking offense that they openly admitted to not reading it, and then attempting to summarize what it said, poorly. If that’s sophistry, so be it. They’re being willfully ignorant.
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A line break or paragraphs or literally any formatting at all would have helped. I suspect it’s an artifact of how the full quote was done as the link, though.
Taking a copy of an infinitely replicable resource is perfectly ethical.
In a world where people’s lives are sustained by a model that diminishes their income when copying instead of buying, you can’t exactly call it “perfectly ethical”.
You can make an argument that your copying isn’t preventing a sale and that probably works most of the time, but not all the time.
I think “it’s complicated” is a more true statement of the conundrum.
The issue is that there exists some sort of digital Bourgeoisie, people that just make their money by owning digital data, while the digital proletariat, the artists and programmers, that creates the data aren’t well financially compensated or might not even be employed at the company anymore.
Pirates should be mindful who they are hurting, and that depends on the piece of work they are pirating, the time when they are doing it and many other circumstances. That decides if is ethical or not.
Creators should be well compensated for their time and effort, so that they continue to create and if that is the case piracy doesn’t matter.
Self published indie game that you really like? Pay for it, support the creator(s)
Music written/recorded by long dead people whose rights are owned by some massive faceless corporation to line the pockets of CEOs and shareholders? Fuck them, pirate away
Future generations will cringe at how much creative innovation has been stifled by our repressive copyright laws, extending it past 20 years flat was a major mistake
Thanks, Disney.
We all stand on the shoulders of giants!
when it was black music or achievements, where were those property rights then? chuck berry was robbed, so were many others. Where was the outrage then? seems to me property is only respected if it comes to the belongings of those in power, but if you are a native american your entire country is up for grabs… how come?
The actual damage is done to the billions of people that are excluded from education, from science and from just books, by property and copy rights. The damage done to mankind done by patent law far exceeds any damage done to individuals holding patents.
We artificially live in a world that is less educated than it could be. I would like to live in the world with the most possible education.
Think about who is damaged by our lack of education? think about who benefits from our ignorance?
Who’s interests outweigh the ability of all of mankind to educate themselves? Our taxes paid for the science, the articles should be gratis.
The artificial scarcity around books, science and generally information and education is affecting the trajectory of mankind.
If all had free access to all information meaning scientific papers, books, plays, literature, musical scores and recordings, then we may have already lived in a start trek style utopia.
How much has mankind’s advancement already been hampered by the sorry state of affairs?
Ummm, actually infinity is just a pure mathematical concept that does not exist in real life 🤓
Sure infinity exists. You see it every time you go outside at night and look up.
The universe isn’t infinite. It’s very big but not infinite.
I mean, it’s not
It’s piracy, a different crime
A crime I love committing babyyyyyyyyyy
Yeah, when you steal something from someone then he does not have it anymore. With indefinitely replicable virtual goods that is not the case.
They have to recoup and make roi on their r&d
… therefore we need to build and violently enforce a legal regime to ensure that content profiteers can extract 100% profit from every transaction?
I don’t make the rules. Blame shareholder fiduciary responsibilities or the spineless politicians. Corporations are gonna corporate
By that logic you can’t blame the politicians because they got bribed, and you can’t blame the citizens because of corporate propaganda and voila! No one has moral responsibility for anything
Politicians’ fiduciaries are their constituents though, so they are the failure there though if they allow corporations to get away with long term harm
I’m not going to hold my breath waiting for some abstract shame or morality to guide politicians’ actions when all the systemic incentives point in the other direction
We here at Futurama do not condone the cool crime of burglary.
“Property is theft!” ~ EA
It’s not piracy it’s reclamation
It’s the theft of profit they don’t like, they don’t care if you watch it, just that you give them money for the opportunity to watch.
No, they still don’t like it when I buy a copy of a video game and then pirate it as well
yup. anti-piracy is about control, not profits. this is trivial to deduce from the simple fact that no one ever measures a drm solution’s performance in total sales recovered, they only ever whine about hypothetical lost ones, which is the corporate equivalent of sideways for attention, long way for effect
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Yep, you can shove your “licence” up there, I bought it it’s mine.
Surprisingly astute point.
What is renting?
Can I get Bullshit answers for $1,000 Alex
Renting is what buying is for corporations today.
Terms of Service would like to speak with you.
ToC wielding guns we just wanna talk!
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By that token, if someone is punching you in the face repeatedly, don’t defend yourself.
You aren’t stealing from the person you’re getting it from, you’re stealing from the person who created it
They can still have it too.
Not stealing, infringing on their copyright.
At least in my country, that’s only if you distribute
Not in the US. Unauthorized reproduction of a copyrighted work for any reason is copyright infringement.
The USA can suck my European Girlcock
Fair, but I just ignore the stupid nonenforceable laws.
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